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  #151  
Old 09-26-2017, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
I believe Einstein likened fanatical atheists to some kind of slaves. Wish I could make contact with him to let him explain further.
He just talked to me from the other side. He told me to give you this message:


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  #152  
Old 09-26-2017, 05:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
I must have missed class that day -- probably had a hangover.
Really a shame you didn't play hooky and get drunk more often. It would have worked wonders.
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  #153  
Old 09-26-2017, 05:46 PM
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Eeeeeeyow!!!!!

Another stinging reposte from the Urban Lad!
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  #154  
Old 09-26-2017, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
You're using your lack of knowledge about a field to judge it. That seems a bit weird. In 'your" mind it doesn't exist. I will grant you that. At least, you're right there.
Only because it is a field that has no implications or truth behind it. I do not, for example, spend too much of my time studying vampire flying rabbits as well, because they do not exist. So if a person comes up to me and tells me I am ignorant of vampire flying rabbits because I refuse to study them, I'm still not going to sit outside with camera traps trying to find one.

Similarly ESP, ghosts, the afterlife etc, none of these have any bearing on me whatsoever. The proponents, if they wanted to be taken seriously should build a bit of tech that utilises the underlying principles, which is well within the parameters of their claims, but there is a really obvious and simple reason why they don't though...
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  #155  
Old 09-26-2017, 06:30 PM
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  #156  
Old 09-26-2017, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
Really a shame you didn't play hooky and get drunk more often. It would have worked wonders.


I went to one semester of college and played hooky and got drunk and high all the time. Doesn't seem to have made me believe in things that aren't real.

Doesn't seem to have made a difference at all in what I believe and know.
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  #157  
Old 09-27-2017, 05:02 AM
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I've always enjoyed Cityboy's fantasy version of college...
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  #158  
Old 09-27-2017, 05:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
Ed, People cause things. For instance, who screwed over the Native-Americans in this great land of theirs? Robots? Why is it so difficult to grasp that messed-up people cause messed-up things to happen to innocents.
No argument there.

Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
Sure, there are natural disasters that cause suffering.
But, I thought you said all suffering is created out of the minds of ignorant people. Are they the cause of these natural disasters? If so, you should have a talk with them, Shelley, about using those powers in a more positive way. Because I know you're all about positivity, and you'd be just the man to do it.

Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
But, we are discussing God and man. Jesus never screwed anybody over. He healed and loved people. Are you too taking the "CIA's" word as truth? Then, I feel sorry for you too.
The CIA's word on what? Jesus screwing people over? What the hell are you talking about, man?

Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
How do you explain blind people having NDEs being capable of describing to a T the doctors and nurses trying to revive them? Are you like the others here saying anyone capable of having supernatural experiences is crazy?
Well, Shelley, like I said, I've been there, and I ain't crazy, but I still don't claim to be able to explain it.

Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
You should be smart enough not to line yourself up with small-minded people. (you did that already with that fool JoeMatt). Read the post above. Try to absorb the point that the author is trying to make. Read Einstein's quote about science being incomplete. Don't worry. "Myers" will pat you on the back anyway. I don't know the point your trying to make, Ed with your post here. You seem as though you just dropped by to toss a steak into the atheist's cage. You don't have to play up to them. They love you as long as you don't mention God. Then, you'll be on the shit list. You know, they are good at bullying. Like that old crew you hung out with in the golden years of this site. Same bullying mentality ... trying to run off anybody who mentions God or disagrees with their viewpoints. The names may be different names, but the tactics are the same.
...yada, yada, yada. And I did mention God.

Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
I'm with you on one thing Ed. I agree that certain stuff, including NDEs, could be the product of many reasons. That said, I think you should go address Picklebottom because he "knows" for certain God doesn't exist. Maybe you could go preach to him because I certainly don't need it. My doors are never bolted. There's just too much uncertainty out there in that vast universe.
I'll remember that next time you're telling someone how fucked up they are for not being certain that you're right.
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  #159  
Old 09-27-2017, 05:29 AM
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Originally Posted by brianpatrick View Post
I went to one semester of college and played hooky and got drunk and high all the time. Doesn't seem to have made me believe in things that aren't real.Doesn't seem to have made a difference at all in what I believe and know.
("...whereas I don't believe in things that are real..." replied the goblin, adding "...not if I know them then, then there's no belief at all, it's just certainty...")
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  #160  
Old 09-27-2017, 08:31 AM
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When it comes to God question, some of you want to hang your hat on scientists (and psychologists), whom you regard as the ultimate authority down here (obviously, otherwise, you would have never introduced them into the discussion). Well, Nikola Tesla was once considered the most intelligent man who lived. He was a scientist and an inventor. Once Albert Einstein was asked how it felt to be the smartest man alive. He replied, "I don't know. You'll have to ask Nikola Tesla."

Below are some of Tesla's quotes about science.
_____________
"The day science begins to study non-physical phenomena, it will make more progress in one decade than in all previous centuries of its existence."

"Today's scientist have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality."

"The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite insane."
"If you want to find the secrets of the universe, think in terms of energy, frequency, and vibration."

"The desire that guides me in all I do is the desire to harness the forces of nature for the service of mankind."

"The history of science shows that theories are perishable. With every new truth that is revealed we get a better understanding of Nature and our conceptions and views are modified."

"The gift of mental power comes from God, Divine Being, and if we concentrate our minds on that truth, we become in tune with this great power."

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  #161  
Old 09-27-2017, 08:33 AM
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Ed, I thought after you broke away from that dirtbag Joematt, you'd have an opportunity to smarten up. Guess not. You're the same old same old -- attack dog for fools. You like playing up to the crowd.

Cocaine sucks. LSD, Heroin, Ups & Downs, Weed, Hash, Opium -- that' was more like it.

Don't waste your time cutting & pasting on what I'm saying (you must have been good at arts & crafts). I'm small potatoes, just as you and everybody else are. Focus on the quotes of Mr. Tesla. He's the brains here, the big fish in the pond. The rest of us, well, you know how that goes ....

Last edited by Cityboy; 09-27-2017 at 09:10 AM..
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  #162  
Old 09-27-2017, 09:27 AM
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So this thread is like old school WB cray cray.

There's a pretty good popular science book written by Michio Kaku who is definitely open minded. 'Science of the impossible' I think it's called. Anyway it's quite useful as a brief jargon free explanation of the scientific basis, if any, of things like telepathy etc.

Speaking of open mindedness it really wasn't that long ago that the two most powerful governments in the world were taking ESP very seriously. If there ever was gonna be any kind of proof of ESP the cold war was its biggest shot. Both Russia and the USA set up departments dedicated to studying it rigorously, both paranoid that the other might tap into some magical advantage over the other -- and after however many millions/billions spent and decades of scientific exploration each eventually abandoned the projects with little to nothing to show for it.

I'm not sure what anyone else would propose to do in this area after that.
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  #163  
Old 09-27-2017, 12:31 PM
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Yeah -- I mentioned the CIA was into ESP etc. for decades before they abandoned it. Right toward the end, they tried to use it to gather info during the Iranian hostage crisis.

Some claim the programs were a success, but they're keeping it all hush hush...
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  #164  
Old 09-27-2017, 02:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
When it comes to God question, some of you want to hang your hat on scientists (and psychologists), whom you regard as the ultimate authority down here (obviously, otherwise, you would have never introduced them into the discussion). Well, Nikola Tesla was once considered the most intelligent man who lived. He was a scientist and an inventor. Once Albert Einstein was asked how it felt to be the smartest man alive. He replied, "I don't know. You'll have to ask Nikola Tesla."

Below are some of Tesla's quotes about science.
_____________
"The day science begins to study non-physical phenomena, it will make more progress in one decade than in all previous centuries of its existence."

"Today's scientist have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality."

"The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite insane."
"If you want to find the secrets of the universe, think in terms of energy, frequency, and vibration."

"The desire that guides me in all I do is the desire to harness the forces of nature for the service of mankind."

"The history of science shows that theories are perishable. With every new truth that is revealed we get a better understanding of Nature and our conceptions and views are modified."

"The gift of mental power comes from God, Divine Being, and if we concentrate our minds on that truth, we become in tune with this great power."

THE FOLLOWING USER SAYS THANK YOU TO NIKOLA TESLA FOR THIS USEFUL POST:
 


Firstly, Tesla never said the last quote. Somebody took that quote out of context and posted it on the internet. It was a description of what his mother told him about how the world worked. He apparently didn't much agree with it.

The rest of his quotes are not talking about what you think they are.

Yes, he was one of the smartest men to ever have lived. He was approaching a way to supply electrical power without distribution wires for free. To everyone. No one will probably ever know how close he was because the idea was anathema to western capitalism. But he wasn't talking about ghosts, spirits, NDE's, ESP, or any other such nonsense. He was talking about science.
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  #165  
Old 09-27-2017, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
Yeah -- I mentioned the CIA was into ESP etc. for decades before they abandoned it. Right toward the end, they tried to use it to gather info during the Iranian hostage crisis.

Some claim the programs were a success, but they're keeping it all hush hush...


I know they figured it out and have been manipulating my brain for decades. One time, I wanted a hamburger, but when I got up to the counter at Smashburger, I ordered a chicken sandwich. Fucking CIA!
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  #166  
Old 09-27-2017, 03:16 PM
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Don't worry -- when all this ESP stuff is figured out, you won't even have to order...
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  #167  
Old 09-27-2017, 10:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
Don't worry -- when all this ESP stuff is figured out, you won't even have to order...


Maybe I won't even have to eat it. I could be sustained by spiritual energy and Tesla's whirring thrum.
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  #168  
Old 09-28-2017, 12:03 AM
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Tesla's whirring thrum will be the chipotle or Sriracha of the future. Once you see it at Wendy's -- it'll be over.

And along the lines of those Tesla quotes -- people do the same with Einstein. He called himself an agnostic -- and he criticized what we'd call new athiests today. Quotes regarding that are what people usually take out of context. He definitely did not believe in anything like a Christian god or spirits or any other hocus pocus.

Last edited by Myers; 09-28-2017 at 04:43 AM..
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  #169  
Old 09-28-2017, 07:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
Tesla's whirring thrum will be the chipotle or Sriracha of the future. Once you see it at Wendy's -- it'll be over.

And along the lines of those Tesla quotes -- people do the same with Einstein. He called himself an agnostic -- and he criticized what we'd call new athiests today. Quotes regarding that are what people usually take out of context. He definitely did not believe in anything like a Christian god or spirits or any other hocus pocus.


There are a lot of people who skim the ideas associated with quantum physics and assume it implies a proof of the existence of pre-cognition or some such thing. But, it doesn't. I searched hard for the kind of new age enlightenment shit that was big in the last century, met tons of people who tried to convince me reality was subjective. The whole idea is poisonous to people. I'm not saying I know the truth, but I mostly know what it's not.
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  #170  
Old 09-29-2017, 02:20 AM
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Originally Posted by brianpatrick View Post
There are a lot of people who skim the ideas associated with quantum physics and assume it implies a proof of the existence of pre-cognition or some such thing. But, it doesn't. I searched hard for the kind of new age enlightenment shit that was big in the last century, met tons of people who tried to convince me reality was subjective. The whole idea is poisonous to people. I'm not saying I know the truth, but I mostly know what it's not.
It's still big now, and in fact some believe it started with Kant and the critique of Pure Reason. The first notion being that things are only perceived through our fallible senses and therefore are never seen as they are. Add things like how little light we see, how little sound we hear, and you can then jump to 'what the bleep do we know!?' -- if you're familiar with that doc it pretty much sums up the modern form of the same philosophy. It tries to philosophically call a truce between science and religion.

I think this really goes back to the fundamental reason why religion exists, and will never go away. It used to e that a negative life would lead to hell, now the negative energy you project compels the universe to conspire against you -- we seem to need a moral system which exists outside of social etiquette and law. In fact, it is said that Kant set out to save religion from the rational materialism which was gaining headway at the time. His biggest proponents praise him for just that.

I haven't read Kant's book but from what I hear it's the most sophisticated and intricate way of saying 'no one can be sure of anything' that one could conceive of. Then materialists come along and say 'look, our senses are all we have to interpret the world, and our reason is the faculty for how we might think and use things in the world to survive, and suggesting that nothing is truly knowable is a sure fire way to zap the confidence out of man leaving him in a state of paralysing uncertainty'. I think people kind of want there to be no distinction between truth and falsehood y'know so everyone gets a gold star and there's nothing much to argue about, whatever you believe is real (gender fluidity comes to mind). And for New Ageists I'd say that is borne out, it's not really about what's true as much as it's about whatever floats your boat.

Of 'no one can be sure of anything' I once heard that that statement includes itself, so no one can be sure that no can be sure of anything.
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  #171  
Old 09-30-2017, 11:13 AM
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“The fanatical atheists are like slaves who are still feeling the weight of their chains which they have thrown off after hard struggle. They are creatures who—in their grudge against traditional religion as the "opium of the masses"—cannot hear the music of the spheres.”
Albert Einstein

As intelligent as he was, he was nevertheless a mere mortal whose guess about the God-question is as good as the person who stood next to him. In his quote above, he was pissed off at fanatical atheists who consume themselves trying to erase the existence of God from the minds of all. Pretty good advice.


John, you can read all the books you want. When you're seeking answers about the mysteries of the universe, you won't find the answers in any book. All you'll be getting is someone's opinion. You MUST experiment yourself, not in controlled settings either. I have seen apparitions and have heard discarnate voices. If you or anybody else has trouble believing it, that's your problem, not mind. The truth is most fanatical atheists wouldn't even believe their own mothers if their moms told them she saw an apparition. So, if they can't believe their mothers, certainly they won't believe me.

I am so grateful to a voice from the other side. Had it not been for the warning seconds before an incident, I wouldn't be here -- that is "the truth." Funny, though, I don't even know whose voice it was. It's good to have "invisibles" watching out for you, believe me.

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  #172  
Old 09-30-2017, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
“The fanatical atheists are like slaves who are still feeling the weight of their chains which they have thrown off after hard struggle. They are creatures who—in their grudge against traditional religion as the "opium of the masses"—cannot hear the music of the spheres.”
Albert Einstein

As intelligent as he was, he was nevertheless a mere mortal whose guess about the God-question is as good as the person who stood next to him. In his quote above, he was pissed off at fanatical atheists who consume themselves trying to erase the existence of God from the minds of all. Pretty good advice.


John, you can read all the books you want. When you're seeking answers about the mysteries of the universe, you won't find the answers in any book. All you'll be getting is someone's opinion. You MUST experiment yourself, not in controlled settings either. I have seen apparitions and have heard discarnate voices. If you or anybody else has trouble believing it, that's your problem, not mind. The truth is most fanatical atheists wouldn't even believe their own mothers if their moms told them she saw an apparition. So, if they can't believe their mothers, certainly they won't believe me.

I am so grateful to a voice from the other side. Had it not been for the warning seconds before an incident, I wouldn't be here -- that is "the truth." Funny, though, I don't even know whose voice it was. It's good to have "invisibles" watching out for you, believe me.


I agree with the Einstein quote. Haven't seen any "fanatical" atheist posts in this thread though. Fanatical atheists, like the communist regimes at certain times in history, killed Christians, or drove them out of their countries. Nobody here is suggesting that.

As far as I'm concerned, as long as a governing body doesn't try to legislate it's religious beliefs, I could not care less what nonsense they want to believe in or worship.
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  #173  
Old 09-30-2017, 03:38 PM
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I think Einstein is talking about what we call New Atheists today -- people who go out of their way to criticize religion and a belief in God as something inherently harmful.

In that respect, I agree with Einstein too. But anyone who's constantly harping at non-believers that they are closed minded etc. (Cityboy) is just the other side of the same coin -- and equally obnoxious.
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Old 10-03-2017, 07:29 AM
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No fanatics? Funny. Anybody who mentions the word church, religion, or God in this forum better be wearing a football helmet. Hey, you are the ones who introduced scientists so I figured I'd bring in a heavyweight (Myers you're such a forgiving person -- first a fraud and now obnoxious -- you should practice what you so lovingly write about). You are close-minded -- anyone whose point of view differs is called all kinds of names and laughed at too. (reread your posts). I don't expect you to "believe" me because you'd have a hard time believing those closest to you.

I couldn't care what your beliefs are because you must believe something. But, for all of you to say "paranormal or supernatural" activities don't exist because you yourselves never experienced it falls under the category of "close-mindedness." Definitely.

Even as an atheist himself, Einstein never bolted the doors of his mind. His quote about religion and science definitely leaves the door cracked:

"Science without religion is lame; religion without science is blind."

You have been using science as concrete evidence that the afterlife is non-existence. Thomas Edison, a scientist, mentioned a device to make contact with spirits. Whether he planned to invent it or whether it would work if he did is another story.

Also, if I had a buck for every time science changed a theory it had originally believed as the "truth," I'd be wealthy.

So, why do you bring science into this discussion? Most people setting out to discover "truths" don't rely on science; they rely upon themselves. They meditate and experiment on their own. And if you invest time doing the same as they have done, some of your "rock-solid" beliefs would crumble. I guarantee you that.
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Old 10-03-2017, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
No fanatics? Funny. Anybody who mentions the word church, religion, or God in this forum better be wearing a football helmet.
No -- not anybody. It's just you...
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Old 10-03-2017, 09:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
No -- not anybody. It's just you...
I might be the only one mentioning "God" here. People remain mum. They don't want to be ridiculed by you and a host of fanatical bullies on this site. I'm sorry if the word "God" makes the hair on the back of your neck stand. But, you are the one hurling science in my face and using it as the "Ultimate" word in the God-question. I know your mind is locked and sealed. Hey, that's what you choose to believe. Good for you. Enjoy your beliefs. I was just pushing back on Pickle's claim that he "knew" God didn't exist. As I said before, peddling "beliefs" as facts is dangerous. You chose to enter the debate armed with psychologists and scientists to prove your point -- that the afterlife is a fairytale. I'm here to explain that science isn't a last word. If you believe it is, then you're skating on thin ice. Science is ever evolving:

"Until recently, scientists believed that the brain replaced its dead cells. New studies, however, prove otherwise." (No need to continue -- you get the point.)

Besides, I'm not responding to hardcore non-believers as yourself and the obvious few others. I'm posting for the fence-sitters. I believe that before they get off the fence, they should give serious thought to the question. They should investigate on their own before deciding one way or the other. When they are finally satisfied with their decision, then they should follow their heart and believe what they have chosen. But, I would hope they never believe anyone who merely says "I know" -- as if his beliefs were the "truth." No way, Jose. Better to remain Agnostic than to make a fool of oneself.

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  #177  
Old 10-03-2017, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
Turn the coin over once and a while instead of spouting the same old stupidity.
Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
The soul behind your pen seems to be that of a cranky or lonely old person.
And who was the first person to weigh in with the personal garbage and insults as soon as he came up against a little friction?

Why the open-minded believer of course!!

No -- it really is JUST you.
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  #178  
Old 10-03-2017, 12:37 PM
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Oh, brother Myers, you too with this cutting and pasting. Let me remind you those statements were made "after" Picklebottom said "He knows." Furthermore, they weren't addressed to you. You waited in the bushes (as usual) to ambush -- such a forgiving person as you are. And, you couldn't resist sticking your nose into the fray (as usual too).

Consider my beliefs about science:

Any scientist who fails to research the supernatural and ignores or denies it isn't a true person of science. To bolster your claim that ESP is merely hogwash, you have introduced phantom "psychologists and scientists," but could you be more specific? Kindly provide names. Identify your phantoms, and I guarantee you will have revealed people just like yourself -- fanatical atheists.

Let me introduce one of the most remarkable minds of the 20th Century (or of any other century), Nikola Tesla. Consider his quotes about the science which you uphold as the "Final Word":

"The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite insane."

"The day science begins to study non-physical phenomena, it will make more progress in one decade than in all the previous centuries of its existence."

Last edited by Cityboy; 10-03-2017 at 12:39 PM..
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Old 10-03-2017, 01:41 PM
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You can look through this list of university research projects -- obviously compiled by someone who wants to believe -- and yet, very little detail about actual positive results. I wonder why.

http://mentalfloss.com/article/54450...earch-projects

The Benn study -- which people often cite as being the most successful, had results based on people guessing the content of images with a 50-50 chance of being correct -- they managed to be correct 53% of the time overall -- but no one has been able to duplicate his results.

It's a good bet most of the people who conduct these studies want to believe or they at least are open to the possibility that ESP exists. That's why the devote years of time and effort. There certainly isn't any evidence that they are "fanatical atheists."

But the results are always negligible...
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Old 10-03-2017, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
Oh, brother Myers, you too with this cutting and pasting. Let me remind you those statements were made "after" Picklebottom said "He knows."
And yet you say you know...

But if someone else's knowing is different than yours, it's "stupidity?"
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