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  #121  
Old 09-25-2017, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by brianpatrick View Post
Think about all the jobs you bid where the client said: "wow, that's it? I thought it would be way more expensive!"
Ha ha ha!

Doesn't that piss you off?

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  #122  
Old 09-25-2017, 07:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
Ha ha ha!



Doesn't that piss you off?


Weekly!
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  #123  
Old 09-25-2017, 07:33 PM
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Yeah -- at least for new clients anyway -- if they don't squeak a little, I know I'm not charging enough.
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  #124  
Old 09-25-2017, 07:49 PM
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Of course, if I had ESP, I wouldn't be doing what I'm doing and sweating it out over bids.

Pretty sure I could finagle it into immense wealth and a life of leisure...
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  #125  
Old 09-25-2017, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
Of course, if I had ESP, I wouldn't be doing what I'm doing and sweating it out over bids.

Pretty sure I could finagle it into immense wealth and a life of leisure...


That's why we need a national school!

Why keep it a secret?

If ESP is really a thing, why not teach all Americans? We could rule the world!

Oh, wait...
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  #126  
Old 09-26-2017, 01:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
For some strange reason, you have programmed yourself to ignore or to mock whatever you don't understand. Your world cannot be so tiny unless you deliberately do it to boost your agenda, which would be so terribly unfair to yourself. Sad.
Why is asking for a person to prove their claim "mocking"?

When asked for proof I've proven the existence of God on this forum, so that any person can now witness Him, but when I ask for a bit of ESP wi-fi technology, well within the realms of the purported ability and so far it still doesn't exist.
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  #127  
Old 09-26-2017, 04:26 AM
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And there's this idea that the scientific community has scoffed at the concept of ESP. Truth is, there have been many exhaustive studies of it -- including the by CIA.

Scientists and psychologists would have nothing to lose by showing there is such a thing -- but the results are always nil.

Otherwise, why can't some number of people with ESP simply put on documented, repeatable demonstrations to prove it exists? I wonder...
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  #128  
Old 09-26-2017, 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted by PickleBottom View Post
Why is asking for a person to prove their claim "mocking"?

When asked for proof I've proven the existence of God on this forum, so that any person can now witness Him, but when I ask for a bit of ESP wi-fi technology, well within the realms of the purported ability and so far it still doesn't exist.
You're using your lack of knowledge about a field to judge it. That seems a bit weird. In 'your" mind it doesn't exist. I will grant you that. At least, you're right there.
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  #129  
Old 09-26-2017, 07:55 AM
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If you're talking about ESP -- some special knowledge doesn't have much to do with it -- although I'm sure you think you have it.

If some kind of repeatable experiment or public demonstration proved that it existed, we would all know about it.

Documented studies and experiments went on for decades -- and nada.

You don't have to be an expert to know that.
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  #130  
Old 09-26-2017, 08:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
And there's this idea that the scientific community has scoffed at the concept of ESP. Truth is, there have been many exhaustive studies of it -- including the by CIA.

Scientists and psychologists would have nothing to lose by showing there is such a thing -- but the results are always nil.

Otherwise, why can't some number of people with ESP simply put on documented, repeatable demonstrations to prove it exists? I wonder...
A good number of scientists are merely prostitutes on the payrolls of governments. Creating weapons that will send our planet farther than Saturn. And a vast number of psychologists could use psychiatrists. What's you point?

You're wrong (again). Scientists have a lot to lose. They could lose the keys to their mansions and lose the keys to their BMWs by sticking their necks out. They want to remain in the "comfty" zone. You know the scientific community shuns anything out of the "ordinary" as though it were the plague. What does a scientist know about dying and death, anyhow? Many build weapons that kill, but they know nothing about the topic itself.
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  #131  
Old 09-26-2017, 08:20 AM
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Ha ha. Yeah -- research scientists live in mansions.

Many studies were conducted using controls that set out to eliminate bias as much as possible -- in research that happened over decades.

So ask yourself -- why all the effort if they were so concerned about upsetting the apple cart?

And it's not like there aren't a gazillion other things researchers could study other than ESP. Which is what happened anyway -- they moved on and nobody was out of a job or lost a BMW or mansion!

And the CIA spent millions try to prove ESP was a thing -- so they could use it their advantage. They were hoping it was real!

Try applying just a little bit of logic.
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  #132  
Old 09-26-2017, 08:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
Ha ha. Yeah -- research scientists live in mansions.

Many studies were conducted using controls that set out to eliminate bias as much as possible -- in research that happened over decades.

So ask yourself -- why all the effort if they were so concerned about upsetting the apple cart?

And it's not like there aren't a gazillion other things researchers could study other than ESP. Which is what happened anyway -- they moved on and nobody was out of a job or lost a BMW or mansion!

And the CIA spent millions try to prove ESP was a thing -- so they could use it their advantage. They were hoping it was real!

Try applying just a little bit of logic.

Researchers, please you're a joker. I could fill this page with hundreds of researchers who have studied ESP and are convinced of its validity. But to a "blind" you, Pickle, and others, they wouldn't be "researchers" but "delusional fools." I have noticed that you and yours only use certain words when its for your convenience. Logic? You must be kidding. First take your head out of the sand before you can even speak about logic. One other thing -- if you and BP enjoy the roles of cheer-leading, I suggest both of you have a sex-change operation, don little shirts, and find a team that could use you. Because, here, you're both making fools of yourselves.
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  #133  
Old 09-26-2017, 08:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
I could fill this page with hundreds of researchers who have studied ESP and are convinced of its validity.
Let's see it then -- just a few would suffice -- and it should be easy if there are so many.

Real studies use methodology and controls to try and eliminate bias -- so don't forget that part.

Okay -- I'm all ears...
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  #134  
Old 09-26-2017, 08:40 AM
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Beyond that -- the idea that scientists or researchers as a whole are worried they might lose their jobs and "mansions" if they discover or uncover something is ridiculous.

It happens all the time. They move on and do something else. The whole notion that they are somehow afraid to rock the boat is moronic -- and everything you are saying about researchers rests on that.

Last edited by Myers; 09-26-2017 at 09:15 AM..
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  #135  
Old 09-26-2017, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
Ha ha. Yeah -- research scientists live in mansions.

Many studies were conducted using controls that set out to eliminate bias as much as possible -- in research that happened over decades.

So ask yourself -- why all the effort if they were so concerned about upsetting the apple cart?

And it's not like there aren't a gazillion other things researchers could study other than ESP. Which is what happened anyway -- they moved on and nobody was out of a job or lost a BMW or mansion!

And the CIA spent millions try to prove ESP was a thing -- so they could use it their advantage. They were hoping it was real!

Try applying just a little bit of logic.
You allow yourself to believe the "CIA," yet because you won't believe credible researchers only proves to me that you're living in a bubble. You should have quit while you believed you were ahead. Yeah, mister, you're absolutely correct -- the "CIA" is going to let you in on things. Keep believing. Logical people would laugh at your statements.

Last edited by Cityboy; 09-26-2017 at 09:47 AM..
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  #136  
Old 09-26-2017, 09:53 AM
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Oh, of course -- the CIA discovered the secrets of ESP -- and they're keeping it a big secret. They're probably reading Putin's mind right now!

Like all lunatic conspiracy theories -- that would require that everyone involved could be somehow silenced FOREVER.

Otherwise -- what credible researchers?
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  #137  
Old 09-26-2017, 12:00 PM
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The person who wrote the article is 100% correct stating that your close-mindedness has turned you yourself into the enemy.

_________________________________

Read what Einstein said, but of course you're "Myers" are your word is Gospel:

In view of these phenomena, it’s not surprising that other physicists have been open-minded about the possibility of pre-cognition and telepathy. Although unconvinced by some of the experimental evidence for telepathy available during his life time, even Einstein was aware that it was not possible to reject it on the basis that they had no place in science. As he remarked, ‘We have no right to rule out a priori the possibility of telepathy. For that the foundations of our science are too uncertain and incomplete.’ (1)

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Picklebottom, read with an open-mind -- if possible.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...parapsychology

In fact, skeptics who rigidly hold to their particular paradigm of reality may have become their own enemies. Their reluctance to consider evidence against their beliefs, and to be open to the possibility that there must be more phenomena in existence than we are aware of, is in itself irrational. It has more in common with the dogmatism of religious fundamentalists than the curious, open-minded approach which scientists should ideally follow.

Perhaps the most irrational approach is to assume that human beings have an objective and complete awareness of reality, and that there are no natural laws or phenomena or forces beyond those we can presently detect or conceive of. There is no reason why psychology cannot be ‘scientific’ at the same time as accepting this.

Notes
1) Many other prominent physicists were (and are) open to the possibility of ESP, including several Nobel prize winners such as Marie Curie, Pierre Curie, Wolfgang Pauli, Joseph Thomson, Eugene Wigner and Arthur Compton and Brian Josephson.

Last edited by Cityboy; 09-26-2017 at 12:14 PM..
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  #138  
Old 09-26-2017, 01:05 PM
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The entire basis of what you're saying as it relates to me is wrong.

I've never said that I wasn't open to the possibility that ESP exists on some level. I am skeptical -- meaning doubtful.

Don't be confused by any sarcastic banter.

All I want to see is something that is verifiable and that can be replicated.

Ah, but that's ALWAYS the bugaboo, isn't it?

The article refers to "positive results," but there's always that disclaimer about how HARD it is to replicate the study.

What it always comes back to is some variation on the theme that ESP is somehow JUST beyond scientific inquiry -- or the standard of research that you would expect with just about anything else.

Which means you have to give it the same amount of credence as any other unexplained phenomena -- real or imagined -- that can't be verified by testing or research.

But according to the article, that's not the real problem -- it's all those skeptical psychologists!

So how come in all the studies that show "positive results," those results are always around 52% or 53% -- just above chance or the expected 50% -- like in the Benn study mentioned in the article?

If ESP is real, then surely, ONE person somewhere should be able to consistently do better than that.

If ESP is real, why hasn't someone ever come up with a simple, repeatable demonstration of it that can be publicly witnessed and documented?

Until, someone does, I will remain doubtful.

And doubtful and "close-mindedness" are not the same thing.

Last edited by Myers; 09-26-2017 at 02:27 PM..
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  #139  
Old 09-26-2017, 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
... And how can you attribute all the world's misery and suffering to God when it was created through the mind's of ignorant people, people who lust for power and material wealth.
That's an awfully broad brush there, Shelley. I don't think there is any one cause of "misery and suffering." And there is definitely more than one degree of it.

Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
Dr. Raymond Moody has studied and written many books about NDEs (Near-Death Experiences) interviewed a man born blind at birth who clinically died on the operating table. The blind person, whose spirit hovered above the doctors and nurses who frantically fought to revive him, correctly described some of the doctors and nurses in the room. When the person was revived, he was once again blind.
I, too, have had a NDE (overdosed on cocaine at age twenty). I saw eternity, was at one with the universe, understood the mind of God, but I'm a realist enough to realize there could have been many causes for what I saw and experienced.

It changed my view of the world dramatically, but not because I believed it was the only or even a reality. It merely provided me with another perspective.
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  #140  
Old 09-26-2017, 03:26 PM
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Ed, People cause things. For instance, who screwed over the Native-Americans in this great land of theirs? Robots? Why is it so difficult to grasp that messed-up people cause messed-up things to happen to innocents. Sure, there are natural disasters that cause suffering. But, we are discussing God and man. Jesus never screwed anybody over. He healed and loved people. Are you too taking the "CIA's" word as truth? Then, I feel sorry for you too.

How do you explain blind people having NDEs being capable of describing to a T the doctors and nurses trying to revive them? Are you like the others here saying anyone capable of having supernatural experiences is crazy?

You should be smart enough not to line yourself up with small-minded people. (you did that already with that fool JoeMatt). Read the post above. Try to absorb the point that the author is trying to make. Read Einstein's quote about science being incomplete. Don't worry. "Myers" will pat you on the back anyway. I don't know the point your trying to make, Ed with your post here. You seem as though you just dropped by to toss a steak into the atheist's cage. You don't have to play up to them. They love you as long as you don't mention God. Then, you'll be on the shit list. You know, they are good at bullying. Like that old crew you hung out with in the golden years of this site. Same bullying mentality ... trying to run off anybody who mentions God or disagrees with their viewpoints. The names may be different names, but the tactics are the same.

I'm with you on one thing Ed. I agree that certain stuff, including NDEs, could be the product of many reasons. That said, I think you should go address Picklebottom because he "knows" for certain God doesn't exist. Maybe you could go preach to him because I certainly don't need it. My doors are never bolted. There's just too much uncertainty out there in that vast universe.

Last edited by Cityboy; 09-26-2017 at 03:38 PM..
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  #141  
Old 09-26-2017, 03:38 PM
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There it is! The obligatory, utterly beside the point Native America reference!

Yipeee!

Oh, and some Jesus thrown in for good measure...

Last edited by Myers; 09-26-2017 at 03:40 PM..
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  #142  
Old 09-26-2017, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
The entire basis of what you're saying as it relates to me is wrong.

I've never said that I wasn't open to the possibility that ESP exists on some level. I am skeptical -- meaning doubtful.

Don't be confused by any sarcastic banter.

All I want to see is something that is verifiable and that can be replicated.

Ah, but that's ALWAYS the bugaboo, isn't it?

The article refers to "positive results," but there's always that disclaimer about how HARD it is to replicate the study.

What it always comes back to is some variation on the theme that ESP is somehow JUST beyond scientific inquiry -- or the standard of research that you would expect with just about anything else.

Which means you have to give it the same amount of credence as any other unexplained phenomena -- real or imagined -- that can't be verified by testing or research.

But according to the article, that's not the real problem -- it's all those skeptical psychologists!

So how come in all the studies that show "positive results," those results are always around 52% or 53% -- just above chance or the expected 50% -- like in the Benn study mentioned in the article?

If ESP is real, then surely, ONE person somewhere should be able to consistently do better than that.

If ESP is real, why hasn't someone ever come up with a simple, repeatable demonstration of it that can be publicly witnessed and documented?

Until, someone does, I will remain doubtful.

And doubtful and "close-mindedness" are not the same thing.
Confused? I read you much too well to be confused by anything you say. You wouldn't believe your most trusted relative if he or she told you about an apparition they had seen. A mountain of evidence would be useless to you. I could tell you stories that would make the hair on your neck stand. But what would be the point? I would be just another "fraud" of yours.


Read what Einstein said, but of course you're "Myers" are your word is Gospel:

In view of these phenomena, it’s not surprising that other physicists have been open-minded about the possibility of pre-cognition and telepathy. Although unconvinced by some of the experimental evidence for telepathy available during his life time, even Einstein was aware that it was not possible to reject it on the basis that they had no place in science. As he remarked, ‘We have no right to rule out a priori the possibility of telepathy. For that the foundations of our science are too uncertain and incomplete.’ (1)

Notes

1) Many other prominent physicists were (and are) open to the possibility of ESP, including several Nobel prize winners such as Marie Curie, Pierre Curie, Wolfgang Pauli, Joseph Thomson, Eugene Wigner and Arthur Compton and Brian Josephson.

Last edited by Cityboy; 09-26-2017 at 03:47 PM..
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  #143  
Old 09-26-2017, 03:51 PM
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Actually, I don't need a mountain of evidence.

Just some kind of verifiable evidence beyond "stories" -- something that isn't purely anecdotal.

Oh well. It's a shame that so many people have these powers of perception -- but for some reason they always evaporate under controlled conditions...

Now tell me how I don't care about Native Americans.
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  #144  
Old 09-26-2017, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
As he remarked, ‘We have no right to rule out a priori the possibility of telepathy. For that the foundations of our science are too uncertain and incomplete.
Hey -- I totally agree with Einstein.

Asking for evidence is not the same as ruling it out...
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  #145  
Old 09-26-2017, 04:05 PM
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I feel sorry for people like you. There isn't a moment that passes when a departed loved one is trying to reach you, but your own arrogant-stupidity prevents that soul from making contact. Maybe, someday you'll smarten up. Hopefully.

Science has virtually given up investigating the paranormal. Why would they when they feel it's a waste of time? I'm pretty sure the last controlled experiments were done during WW II by a Dr. Rhine and his wife. The experiments were performed at a major university but the name of it escapes my memory.
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  #146  
Old 09-26-2017, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
I'm pretty sure the last controlled experiments were done during WW II by a Dr. Rhine and his wife. The experiments were performed at a major university but the name of it escapes my memory.
I guess you didn't read the article you posted...

Okay -- got to go -- I think my deceased grandma is telling me I need to flip the burgers.
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  #147  
Old 09-26-2017, 04:15 PM
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Native-Americans view "the beyond," and what western culture calls death, as merely a transition to the next world.

But, your college professor who had his nose pointed into a book nearly all his life and who taught you all you know, told you that Native-Americans were delusional. College did wonders for you.
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  #148  
Old 09-26-2017, 04:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Cityboy View Post
But, your college professor who had his nose pointed into a book nearly all his life and who taught you all you know, told you that Native-Americans were delusional. College did wonders for you.
I must have missed class that day -- probably had a hangover.
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  #149  
Old 09-26-2017, 05:10 PM
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I believe Einstein likened fanatical atheists to some kind of slaves. Wish I could make contact with him to let him explain further.

He also said science is incomplete too. So mentioning science to bolster your argument leaves you standing on one leg with a banana peel underneath your foot.
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  #150  
Old 09-26-2017, 05:21 PM
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I remember that college professor though.

Horn rimmed glasses, smoked a pipe and wore a tweed jacket with patches on the elbows. Talked like that English guy on Star Trek.

And yeah the whole time I was there -- just the one guy.
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